Transcripts
Interview by Assistant Secretary for South and Central Asian Affairs Richard A. Boucher with Aybek Aldabergenov of Era TV
Astana, Kazakhstan
June 6, 2007
QUESTION: Good morning, Mr. Boucher. The last time when you visited Kazakhstan was in February, right on the eve of the president’s annual address to the nation. It was the subject of your discussions with the president. This time when you come to Kazakhstan it’s the time when the serious amendments have been made initiated by the president and passed by the parliament to the constitution. What is your assessment of the upcoming reforms?
ASSISTANT SECRETARY BOUCHER: We’ve followed this process very closely. The future of Kazakhstan is important to us. We want to see Kazakhstan develop as a stable, independent nation for the long term in the future. These constitutional amendments go in the right direction. The overall effect over the long term could be to strengthen political parties, strengthen the power of parliament. There have been concerns about the lifting of term limits on the president, but it remains to be seen how that will work out in the longer term. I think our overall view would be this is a step forward. It’s a good legal framework. It points the way to a stable, democratic system. Now we’re watching to see how the next steps are going to be handled. Is there going to be a full discussion of the laws that are necessary? How are the laws going to be passed to implement the constitutional changes? We’re waiting to see how it’s going to work in practice.
QUESTION: As the official spokesman for the Department of State has lately stated, that having reviewed the developments in Kazakhstan, that the steps are being made in the right direction. You have noted the concerns on lifting the limits on the reelection of the first president. But it was the parliament who initiated this particular amendment, and it reflects the opinion of the majority of the Kazakhstani population. For many, Nazarbayev is the guarantor of stability. Could you in more detail give your opinion of that?
ASSISTANT SECRETARY BOUCHER: I think we understand that. We understand how people feel. The only thing I’d note is that this one particular measure has tended to dominate the press coverage and the views of many people outside of Kazakhstan. As our spokesman indicated, we’ve gone through the amendments very carefully ourselves, and as I said and as he said, overall we do believe this is a step in the right direction. It’s a very important development for Kazakhstan in terms of establishing long-term stability. It’s an important development in terms of establishing the institutions of the state, the balanced institutions of the state. Kazakhstan, President Nazarbayev have done a lot to establish an independent nation and bring it far on the path of development. But if you look out on the horizon, Kazakhstan needs to develop the institutions that can guarantee its independence and stability for a long time to come. Our belief is that that kind of stability is best guaranteed by a set of democratic institutions that can represent the people and let them decide over the long term how they want the state to develop.
QUESTION: Last December the United States and the United Kingdom didn’t satisfy or didn’t recognize Kazakhstan for chairmanship in OSCE. A number of remarks have been made on the imperfection of the system of local self-governance, election legislation, and the law on media. Amendments to the constitution have been made on the first two points, on the local self-governance and the election legislation. But this law on the media itself is outstanding. Could you, and this is the question, give your assessment of the law and do you think in a developed society there is a need for a media law? And in the context of the First Amendment to the American constitution?
ASSISTANT SECRETARY BOUCHER: We in the United States really don’t have much legislation on the media. If you want to start a newspaper, you register the business, and you start a newspaper. If you want to start a television station, you do have to register, you do have to get a frequency and meet obligations for public service, but that’s a fairly straight forward and a very transparent procedure. So I guess we come at it from the point of view that the freer the media, the better it is for the nation. I see things in the press every day that I don’t like, or that I don’t think are accurate. They criticize the government, they criticize things that I am doing. That’s the way our system works, and the only counter-balance to that is that we have the chance to put out our point of view. I think Kazakhstan is going to have to find its own way in this regard. But the best way to find a balance in the media is to allow all points of view and to let the media perform a public service of bringing out all the debates, all the ideas, all the different points of view so that people can be informed to make their decisions. You touch on a more important question, though, that the constitutional changes are very important. But this process of debate and discussion and passing legislation that implements these changes, that’s very important. That’s ultimately going to determine how it works for the people of Kazakhstan.
QUESTION: Nevertheless, do you think that the Kazakhstani law on mass media meets the international standards?
ASSISTANT SECRETARY BOUCHER: That’s a question that’s not easy for me to make a judgment on. I don’t think I know it well enough. Our people that have looked at it have said yes, there are certain good guarantees in the law. But to really go though it thoroughly in relation to practices elsewhere or standards that are used around the world, I think you need to get experts like the OSCE experts or various journalist experts who can look at that for you and tell you how it relates to other laws that other countries have.
QUESTION: Officially Washington is very closely looking at the developments in Kazakhstan and very actively it is being discussed a scandal in our country. Ex-Ambassador Rakhat Aliyev is being charged with abduction, kidnapping of people. How do you assess? How does the United States of America assess the action taken by the president? And how far this scandal may have an impact on the image of Kazakhstan? At the same time the public is saying that the [inaudible] in Kazakhstan, a cleansing has started, and that laws start to work regardless of positions and rank. What is your opinion?
ASSISTANT SECRETARY BOUCHER: I think the simple answer to your question is I don’t know how this will affect Kazakhstan’s image. In the end it’s going to depend on how it’s handled. I think every country has its scandals, some more serious than others. These are very serious charges that have been brought against Mr. Aliyev. What the world wants to see, I think, what the people will be interested in is, is it handled the way you say, is it handled according to the law, is it handled in a transparent manner, does it show that the law will be applied to everyone. So we’re watching this, we’re very interested in how it turns out. We’re certainly not involved in any way, shape or form. We’ll see. We’ll see how the process unfolds. We’ll see how the laws apply.
QUESTION: Thank you, but we hope this scandal may in no way affect the prospects of Kazakhstan Chairmanship in OSCE, but this is not a question. Now maybe a few questions on the purpose of your visit itself. The issues of energy. Our president has been always saying about a multi-vector and good relations with the neighbors policy. The United States, Russia and China are all strategic partners and equally important. At the same time the president very clearly put in that the economic questions are more important than political questions. In this connection, the preference for the transportation of energy resources was given over to the northern neighbor. For us it’s important your opinion on the deal between Kazakhstan, Russia and Turkmenistan on the construction of this Caspian bypass pipeline, and on the latest statements made by Kazakhstan on the preference given to the routes going through Russia.
ASSISTANT SECRETARY BOUCHER: Let me just start by saying the purpose of my visit is the overall relationship. Energy is only one part. The two governments have been working very hard to expand economic and business relations, to expand our security cooperation, to expand our cooperation on democracy and political reform. I’m also here to discuss the region and how the United States and Kazakhstan can cooperate in this region, indeed the wider region including Afghanistan. We do agree with the strategy of multiple routes and multiple options. The balance between different routes gives you better opportunities, better prices for your natural resources. So we’ve welcomed the expansion of exports to Russia. We welcome the exports beginning to China. And we’ve encouraged other routes and other options, because it’s good for Kazakhstan. In the end, for all of us globally it helps diversify sources of energy. I think our view would be that Turkmenistan deserves the same sorts of multiple options. They’ll want to develop and expand all their different routes. So you see in the agreement with Russia on a northern Caspian route, which I guess at this point it looks like a political declaration maybe more than a pipeline. But that’s one of the options for Turkmenistan. There are other options as well -- possibilities of exports across the Caspian, for example; agreements with China on the export of gas; export of gas or electricity to the south. If you try to look at it as what’s best for Turkmenistan, what’s best for the people of Turkmenistan, they’ll want to get the maximum benefit from their energy resources. If they always have only one route and one customer, they’re going to get a lower price. So if they want to get the best benefit then they are going to want to develop different routes, different opportunities they can use and really participate in world energy markets. So we’re not out here to say don’t do this, don’t do that. We’re here to say you have different opportunities. We can help you look at them all.
QUESTION: Kazakhstan in the past has renounced from its nuclear weapons. And you know that for now President Nazarbayev also chairs the Commonwealth of Independent States. Therefore, the deployment of intermediate range missiles in Eastern Europe puts the security of this large region under a big question.
ASSISTANT SECRETARY BOUCHER: Sorry, did he say intermediate range missiles?
QUESTION: Yes.
ASSISTANT SECRETARY BOUCHER: Whose missiles?
QUESTION: On the territory of Poland, and you probably remember some five days ago the question was discussed at the level of the Minister of Foreign Affairs. So the question is because of the concern that it may have impact on the security of the CIS.
ASSISTANT SECRETARY BOUCHER: But you need to get the facts right. There is no deployment of intermediate range missiles on the territory of Europe. What we’re talking about is deploying in Poland and the Czech Republic a very small missile defense system. These are not offensive missiles. Those missiles have been banned by previous agreements, and we stand by all the previous agreements. This is a very small system, relatively speaking. Its purpose is to stop a few missiles that might be sent by a country like Iran. Its intention is to stop missiles like that from reaching Europe. It has virtually no capability against an arsenal as large as the Russian one. So this is a way of protecting Europe from a threat, from a country that has a small missile force, and it has no affect on the strategic balance, has no affect on Russia’s security, or the security of the CIS countries except to the extent that it might be able to stop a missile that was fired at those countries. Let me say, Kazakhstan has an exemplary record on nuclear non-proliferation. Kazakhstan made a strategic decision, made the right decision many years ago, and has benefited ever since from the stability that that decision helped bring about. So our only interest is in adding to that stability throughout Europe, and that’s what this missile system could help do.
QUESTION: Thank you.
ASSISTANT SECRETARY BOUCHER: Thank you very much.